Having lived in a few places but still proud to be a Jock whose home town is Methil, I am really interested in real people's view of the independence issue.
I know maybe this is not the forum for this but its the best place for me! If you don't like this being here just ignore it...no rant comments necessary!
I am so opposed to the whole thing
but recognise that our Alex is the most astute contemporary politician in Britain by a hundred miles!

Full independence is too big a step, so the "dev max" option seems the most sensible way to go.

After a few years, if we find that dev max is enough then great, if not, then seek full independence at that point.

The good thing about dev max is that whoever is in power at hollyrood can track whatever westminster is doing anyway, so it fits all political parties.

Full Independence now.We dont need to hang onto Englands coattails .If the country's going to be fucked let us Scots fuck it no some high classed fuckhead down south.

Fuck Cameron and his cronies lets get our referendum but on our own terms and our own timescale.Was watching Questiontime on Thursday and the way the panel ganged up on Sturgeon was reminiscent of the way they treated Nick Griffin,ENGLISH BASTARDS

Just back from a holiday where I had the misfortune to chat to this idiot from Devon on the subject of Scottish independence. He brought it up, BTW, not me!
According to this idiot, the Scots couldn't survive on their own and need all the help they can get from England.
And also (and for the life of me I couldn't fathom this one out!), the Scots have caused nothing but trouble for the ENGLISH government by occupying Northern Ireland (no, I'm NOT making this up!). All the trouble in Northern Ireland is caused by the Scots according to this idiot.
Fortunately I switched off at that point

I would rather see a federal UK with Scottish Northern Irish, English and Welsh parliament with standardised methods of agreeing on social security, defence and foreign policy in a wholly elected UK upper house legislature.

Either that or Communist dictatorship of the proletariat but Im no fussy either way really.

I favour an independent Scottish Republic within Europe but comments like the above are as racist as the aforementioned Griffin. No way to speak about our neighbours.

I REFER YOU BACK TO JIM CORSTORPHINES POST MATE.

Can there be any question now that Scotland is ready to stand alone in Europe as a beacon of tolerance.

Jim,would that be the Scots who were forced to leave Scotland while it was under Catholic rule.?
History,how boring it was at school eh.


As for Salmond, he is an arrogant/ignorant knobhead.
Ooooh lets cover Scotland in 100,000 windmills that only work when the wind blows hard enough to move them(approx 65 days a year in Scotland),and have to get switched off when it gets too windy.
And when he visited our local windmill factory last year,regarding renewable energy,he said.
Quote,"Methil will shake the innards of the earth".
He is a nutter.
You are paying for this psycho's deluded dreams on yer power bills.PATHETIC JOKE.
Lets open 300 Whisky shops in China,the poisoning of Chinese people will pay for yer free prescriptions here.
The guy thinks he is never wrong.
And the ugly truth is, he is wrong about loads of things.
And lets no talk about his close ties with the Arab's and Chinese,who,we all well know.Just love torturing oppressing and killing people.Right.
People who think they are right most of the time,actually turn out to be wrong most of the time.
And i suppose that may include me.
Yes we probably should be independent,but with this prick as a President,no thanks.
Peace,brothers and sisters.

I agree with most of what you say comrade but the English chap was perhaps referring to the Scots Presbyterian plantation of Ulster which the British State encouraged at shift the balance of property owning (and therefore voting rights) away from the Catholic majority). However opening that particular can of worms often leads to examples of how unliberal and intolerant we Scots can be. we prefer to see these characteristics in our English cousins particularly if they dare to question or doubt Scotland.
If the majority wanted independence I would accept that and hope it would mean we could have a grown up and tolerant relationship with our neighbours.

If England win the world cup in 2014, independence is a certainty!

Full independance for me.

Ditch the unelected Queen and hangers on when were at it.Nothing but parasites.

Quite simple Lazio. Never mind who leads now! Salmond has raised the anti. Independence firsthand we can elect who we want soon after. I for one will vote for a clean break no matter who is in charge. For the simple reason I am Scottish first. Have my doubts about winning the referendum though as there are a very large amount of rangers supporters who are British first and Scottish second. Pity that football fans and religion will decide our National freedom. Then there are the voters who will chose the union if any hint that we may pay a wee bit more tax. Again, money before National pride. The same reason we lost our nationality in the first place in the 1700's.

Let's hope they open 3000 Scotch whisky shops in China and anywhere else for that matter!

Is there such a thing as a scottish owned whisky ditillery anymore?If we get independance then we can claim them all back.

40% of distilleries are foreign owned,30% have English owners and 30% are either owned by Scottish companies or Scottish family owned.

Who cares? As long as they make the whisky here and create jobs here, that is what matters.

Do you think British businessmen are better than foreign ones? Do you think British businessmen pay themselves fairly?

Just to make clear, I am talking about big business chairmen, directors etc, not small ones.

I think I should make it clear that I don't want to be associated with the "ENGLISH BASTARDS" statement.
I have many friends south of the border; indeed, my mother was English and therefore half of my relatives are English, and I would like to say that not one of them has or had any disparaging views towards the Scots or their country. Far from it.
They all love Scotland, but unfortunately there are some mis-informed English people, like the idiot I encountered on holiday (as well as, granted, several politicians whose actions and words are nothing short of racist!) who are perhaps a bit lacking in their knowledge of our country. That is all I was trying to say.

Fuck the SNP! Bunch of haggis eating faggots.

Moe I take it your an incomer well then fuck of to your place of birth,don't give us true scots your bullshit.If your are English go home we don't need you and it will give a scotsman a chance of a job in his country of birth.Be sensible go now before your chased out.

Just did a search on google for "define an English person" - intresting top answer!

please enlighten us if you will.

Quite a sad thread for me. I often sit amoungst you and am as Scottish and as much a Fifer as the lot of you. However i know what it means to be British I have stood next to Englishmen when the shit has hit the fan and we have stood shoulder to shoulder and most of us have come out the other side. The ones who didn't have been laid to rest with us all once again by their side. I wish that we could see past the like's of Alex Salmond and Cameron.. They are both pricks. Our problem is we are waiting for a leader, worryingly I am not sure when he / she will come. Remember this that as Scotsmen our greatest and most loyal allies are the English! as we are to them. 1314, 1645 fair enough we had issues, but that is in the past and as the song says it is where it should remain.. Can we rise ? Yep but the only way to rise in the next hundred years is in europe. So the aim is and should be to be wake up the labour heartlands and make sure that we don't end up either as a minor zone in the empire of the home counties or as another fucked up state like Ireland dependant on handouts. Scotland can lead the UK again. Mark my words in not so many years people will say " iF Brown had won he election"........ YEP you know it is true

Good post BT. Apart from a few morons, independence isn't about hating English people or not wanting to be friends or allies with England.

I don't look at individuals differently if they're from Scotland, England, America or Japan. People are people (well, maybe not folk from Cowdenbeath). This is about what's in Scotland's best interests as a society and there's nothing wrong with wanting to become an independent nation, like the other 270 odd of them in the world and thinking that is what's best for Scotland.

The Labour party have become a complete disgrace, I'm sad to say. It's pointless hanging around waiting for them to rediscover principles and purpose that were lost years ago. The SNP are the only party with a positive view for Scotland's future now.

not totally...but generally agree with last two posts

Err, loyal allies the English? Just how much more do you want them to screw Scotland? Fucked our economy up after 1707, used Scots to fight their colonial wars, mis-managing Scotland's economy after the war and then taking our oil. Now of course they have sold up and bought all the best properties in Scotland and taken Scottish jobs. Go to an Edinburgh bar in the evening and all you will hear are English voices. In England, the upper middle classes and above actually consider Edinburgh as their exclusive property. Local folk are considered a minor irritation.

Shoulder to shoulder? What planet are you on pal? The English look down on The Scots and Welsh as low-life and a drain on their resources - and that's when they are being polite.

Ireland a fucked up state? Is England not fucked up then with borrowings in excess of a Trillion pounds and what's more, dragged Scotland and Wales down with them? Why just Ireland? What about Latvia and Estonia? They are more than happy to be no longer part of greater Russia and are doing fine.

Labour heartlands? Go and do one pal. The Labour party want a benefits-dependent central lowlands belt to guarantee 41 seats in the English Parliament for the Labour Party. Milliband, Balls or the next likely leader of the Labour Party, Yvette Cooper, don't give a shit about Scotland.

You have a one-off chance to gain independence and become a free country again, away from the warped and twisted politics of England and its decision to grossly over-populate this island. My advice is don't fuck it up this time; you owe it to your ancestors, you owe it to yourselves and you owe it to future generations. Make the difference.

Shoulder to shoulder?? No problem with that!! BUT, as an independent nation WE will decide when to to fight alongside each other, not forced into illegal wars.

Loving the dim witted comments slagging Salmond about windmills, on the day that he announces 500 jobs in METHIL at the energy park. LOL. You couldn't make it up! Salmond's playing a blinder, whether you like him or not. So who do you beleive, Samsung or Michelle fecking Mone?

100% YES to independence.
As long as we're part of the UK, we're hostages to fortune. We get what England votes for. Nothing against English people whatsoever, but Scotland is a country, with its own priorities.

Labour had their chance both in Scotland and in the UK, and they made a complete arse of it. So it's either decades of Tory rule, or a fairer society under independence. We're paying for stuff like Trident missiles and illegal wars, so that DAVID CAMERON and his Tory pals can strut about on the world stage with the big boys, while our pensioners are freezing and our kids are growing up in poverty.

That's the reality of "the union". It serves the few politicians who benefit from it, and nobody else.
It's past its sell by date, we're all in the EC now so there are no borders as far as trade and movement are concerned.

Scotland's well thought of around the world, so have some confidence in yourselves. Grow yourself a spine. Stand up and take control of your own destiny and that of your kids. Independence is what WE make it, not Salmond, or Tommy Sheridan, or Sean Connery.

With independence, with our own voice in the world, our future is ours to mold as we wish. We've got what it takes, all we need is the guts to use it.

So please, grasp it with both hands because we'll NEVER get this chance again.

well said that man.yes it really is up to us,not some faceless arsehole down in london.give yourselves and our country a break and go for it,you know it makes sense.

Oh Dear me.. What have we got here. Anyway, we will see when fat Salmond, the pie eating hot air merchant, get's his five minutes, along with the drag queen Sturgeon. Freeeedom eh! With them incharge, nah if it happens so be it democracy is fine by me let the vote go ahead. If it did, I would be the first to start a independance for Fife party as all our money would be poured into shit art in Edinburgh and scum in WESTCOASTLAND. Fife, We would maybe get another roundabout. Freeeedom LOL Drag Queen lovers LOL
PS Could any of you lot loan me a short bread tin and a Corries CD............ You have all been eating far too much Haggis.

BT. You have just made the case for independence with your remarks.

1. Leave the union.
2. Vote for the party you want to run Scotland, doesn't have to be Snp!
3. Fight for your county if not happy, that's the attitude, well said BT.

Turbines turn only when the wind blows.
Electricity from the national grid is provided on a demand and supply basis,turbines work on a supply and demand basis,the exact opposite of what is required.
Tens o millions paid out last year in Scotland to turn off turbines,because of no demand for the power,i.e.,through the night.
The future's bright,is it feck.
And as for it being free power,dont make me laugh.Do you think you will ever see a reduction on your bill.NO CHANCE.
Can you really trust Salmond,who is a regular at the bookies,and visits fortune tellers.
C'mon people,there is a war on, and it is for the control of your mind.WAKE UP.

You'll be wanting a third option on the ballot paper then as energy is a devolved issue?

A lot of you are missing the point. A YES vote isn't for the SNP. A YES vote is for the restoration of the full powers to the people of Scotland to return a parliament of their choosing. These powers were taken away by an undemocratic process in 1707 "parcel of rogues in a Nation (Burns)".

Absolutely superb post. Well written, well said

Who will own the Bass Rock?

Well said J.C.

See if you'd just quit after your first post, you wouldn't have shown yourself up as an absolute idiot.

It's time to make sure your birthplace was Scotland we need to look after our own first.Incomers come much later.Scotland for the Scots first then all others after that.Scotlands businesses to be sorted out,Scotlands enegy to be sold to other countries at a profit which will benefit the price for Scotland.Look after number one first.

See if you'd just quit after your first post, you wouldn't have shown yourself up as an absolute idiot.[/quote]

LOL......

Sorry but this kind of tripe is not what a YES vote is about. This is a vote to restore full powers to the Scottish Parliament. People residing in Scotland are entitled to vote regardless of their place of birth. "Incomers" included.

CEBR confirm Scotland stands on own financial feet
Sun, 12/02/2012 - 13:24
Finance Secretary has welcomed the Sunday Times front page story "English subsidy of Scots ‘a myth’" stating that the Centre for Economics and Business Research have concluded that unlike other parts of the UK Scotland receives no net subsidy from the rest of the UK.

Responding to the article, Mr Swinney said:

"An independent Scotland will be the sixth-wealthiest country in the developed world in terms of GDP per head, and our public sector debt is lower than the UK’s, and lower than the EU and G7 average – confirming our underlying economic strength with independence.‬‪

"This positive report is based on allocating Scotland 83 per cent of North Sea revenues - while the most recent Government Expenditure and Revenue (GERS) figures show that 91.4 per cent of oil and gas revenues belong to Scotland on a geographical basis.

“Year-on-year, Scotland is in a stronger financial position than the UK as a whole. Taking all Scottish revenues and all spending in Scotland into account – including the net cost of the financial sector interventions – the official GERS statistics show that Scotland has run a current budget surplus in four of the five years to 2009/10, while the UK was in current budget deficit in each of these years, and hasn’t run a current budget surplus since 2001/02.‬‪

“In the five years to 2009/10, Scotland was in a stronger financial position than the UK as a whole to the tune of £7.2 billion – or nearly £1,500 for every person in Scotland.”‬‪

Filed under: finance Independence SNP