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Away From The Numbers

All good things come to an end. Or so they say. AFTN has been around since 1989, first as a fanzine and then making the jump to a website and forum in 2003. We've been through the many ups and down at East Fife in those 12 years but policing the forum has become a giant pain in the ass in recent years. As such, we made the decision not to renew it when it expired.

The forum is no more and will remain as a locked archive until it is eventually deleted by the host. We're looking in to try to save some of the content as an archive.

This is not the end of AFTN though. The site will continue and will be revamped and return in its full glory for the start of the 2016/17 season. Maybe even sooner. There will be a comment sections and possibly even a new, registered forum. Check our Twitter (@aftnwebsite) for all the latest info and we'll also post in on the EFFC memories Facebook page.

Until then, have a last browse here, thanks for all your support over the years, and 'Mon the Fife.

GoF

 

East Fife
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Buy East Fife FC

Today I received an email from the EFSS inviting me to help ‘Buy East Fife FC’. Not expected, but not unwelcome either. Supporters are being asked if they would like to make a monthly financial donation to allow a bid to be made for ownership of the majority shareholding at EFFC and provide working capital with which to run the club.

Without hesitation, I’m in. The present circumstances offer the strongest opportunity to replace the absentee owners in the 15 years that they have been in control.

Fans will want to know details about the offer to the majority shareholders would be, how the debt would be dealt with, who would run the club, whether the existing directors would be part of the bid, and so on. I am keen to know these details too, but at this stage they are not crucial. Any pledges made are non-binding, and if for instance I reckoned any eventual offer vastly overvalued the majority shareholding, I can withdraw. I hope sincerely that this scenario does not come to pass.

The priority is to get behind the chance that has been put before us, whether we are diehards, lapsed fans, directors, Trust members or trolls. This is the first serious and appeal that has been made to the East Fife community during the current saga to come together, by each making an individual financial pledge for the collective good – to break with the recent past and rebuild East Fife into a club everyone can be proud of again.

I would urge East Fife supporters to respond to the Buy East Fife FC appeal. There has never been a better chance to make a difference.

Re: Buy East Fife FC

Dear Supporter

We need your quick feedback.

Later this week we are meeting with a Credit Union to discuss the possibility of using them to raise money to purchase the majority shareholding and to provide working capital.

The idea is that the Credit Union would advance us the money as a loan which would be paid back over a period of time. This would mean we could make an immediate payment for all the shares - which may appear a more attractive offer to the seller than what seems to be on offer at the moment.

Many of you had already said you were willing to pledge a monthly amount and we'd like to know if you're still interested in doing so. If our proposal works out we'd be looking for people to pay up whatever amount they wanted to give over a specific period - say three years - rather than having an open-ended commitment.

We'll be in a position to provide more details after our meeting which is planned for Thursday 29th January.

Please reply NOW by emailing info@buyeastfife.org or hitting the reply button. Let us know if you are still willing to support and if possible what monthly amount you would commit too




Thanks

The EFFS Working Group
Allan Duthie; Laura Anderson; Stephen Mill; Eugene Clarke; Liam Anderson; Paul Munro; Colin McInnes; Kerriann Paterson







Re: Buy East Fife FC

I'm in

Hopefully this is the beginning of a new area.

Re: Buy East Fife FC

A golden chance to stand together in Black and Gold and return the club to East Fife people; and I include messrs Stevenson, Marshall, Donaldson and Barclay in that statement as they are, without a shadow of doubt, East Fife people.
Let's seize this opportunity and regain control of the club we love.

Re: Buy East Fife FC

East Fife Forever
A golden chance to stand together in Black and Gold and return the club to East Fife people; and I include messrs Stevenson, Marshall, Donaldson and Barclay in that statement as they are, without a shadow of doubt, East Fife people.
Let's seize this opportunity and regain control of the club we love.



Personally, I`d be looking to remove all of them.
They are bottom dwellers and time they moved on to spend more time pruning their garden.

Re: Buy East Fife FC

I'd wait and see how much your repayments are going to be for the loan, before you make daft statements like that. You will be committing yourself to a fair share of these payments, won't you? Do you know how much the loan will be yet? If they are bottom dwellers, then you are what they feed on.

Re: Buy East Fife FC

Equaliser, you are talking tripe regards the current 4 directors. There is absolutely no doubt they are East Fife through and through and give both their time and money keeping the club going.
They would be the first to admit they are not a gang of Lord Sugars.
What we need now though is to pull together all resources available from the current board and EFSS to have one bid for control of the club.
Together we can achieve what we all want, a solvent, successful club that we and future generations can have pride in.
We are in this together, East Fife forever.

Re: Buy East Fife FC

Did the current board reject a fan ownership scheme ?

Re: Buy East Fife FC

I certainly appreciate the efforts made by the EFSS.

I've made my pledge, and as Donald mentioned, one can always withdraw at a later date if the offer looks to be significantly over the valuation.

I hope the East Fife supporters can come together and get behind this.

Our Club needs Us.

Re: Buy East Fife FC

Excellent work behind the scenes to get to the stage where there is a very real prospect of the fans of East Fife becoming owners of their club. I echo what Donald said about all fans, that includes shareholders, diehards, far flung fans, young and old evryone who has the club at heart.

I would urge people to respond and pledge what they can realistically afford to get this club back on track.

Well done again to EFSS for getting to this stage.

Re: Buy East Fife FC

mr305
Did the current board reject a fan ownership scheme ?


No.

Re: Buy East Fife FC

S_Pat
Excellent work behind the scenes to get to the stage where there is a very real prospect of the fans of East Fife becoming owners of their club. I echo what Donald said about all fans, that includes shareholders, diehards, far flung fans, young and old evryone who has the club at heart.

I would urge people to respond and pledge what they can realistically afford to get this club back on track.

Well done again to EFSS for getting to this stage.


He also included directors!

Re: Buy East Fife FC

Realist
S_Pat
Excellent work behind the scenes to get to the stage where there is a very real prospect of the fans of East Fife becoming owners of their club. I echo what Donald said about all fans, that includes shareholders, diehards, far flung fans, young and old evryone who has the club at heart.

I would urge people to respond and pledge what they can realistically afford to get this club back on track.

Well done again to EFSS for getting to this stage.


He also included directors!


Hiya Jocky. Hiya pal.

Re: Buy East Fife FC

Am I the only one who feels uneasy about this. The trust is asking to pledge again for the purchase of shares. We have already done this. Is the new appeal in the hope it get a greater commitment with which to impress the lender? At least the directors gave the amount they needed. Withdrawable pledges are not going to have much impact on the lender's decision especially when they have been given blindly with no knowledge of amount needed or a plan of action.

Although I have respect for the trust I have always felt they have held their cards too close to their chest and that is particularily so here despite their earlier promise of transparency.

The director's bid was always a joke and I said it was a smokescreen to influence the SFA case against Rankine. This seems more of the same?

In fact the whole affair is beyond ajoke and is descending into farce with a constant battle between the directors and the trust when they should be working together. Unfortunately the directors have to toe Rankine's line but the trust does not so why do they expect us to blindly pledge?

Not for me even though I can withdraw later.

Re: Buy East Fife FC

JJ
Am I the only one who feels uneasy about this. The trust is asking to pledge again for the purchase of shares. We have already done this. Is the new appeal in the hope it get a greater commitment with which to impress the lender? At least the directors gave the amount they needed. Withdrawable pledges are not going to have much impact on the lender's decision especially when they have been given blindly with no knowledge of amount needed or a plan of action.

Although I have respect for the trust I have always felt they have held their cards too close to their chest and that is particularily so here despite their earlier promise of transparency.

The director's bid was always a joke and I said it was a smokescreen to influence the SFA case against Rankine. This seems more of the same?

In fact the whole affair is beyond ajoke and is descending into farce with a constant battle between the directors and the trust when they should be working together. Unfortunately the directors have to toe Rankine's line but the trust does not so why do they expect us to blindly pledge?

Not for me even though I can withdraw later.

Well said JJ, I don't usually agree with you, but what you say makes sense. What kind of return will the Credit Union be expecting for their money? Not one person as asked that, how much money will we need. The EFSS and all its followers are always bleating about being open and transparent, what has their announcement told us, nothing methinks. Correct me if I am wrong but Stu and Grant have posted without a gripe, that must be a first. Nae doot, their pledges will swing things.

Re: Buy East Fife FC

JJ
Am I the only one who feels uneasy about this. The trust is asking to pledge again for the purchase of shares. We have already done this. Is the new appeal in the hope it get a greater commitment with which to impress the lender? At least the directors gave the amount they needed. Withdrawable pledges are not going to have much impact on the lender's decision especially when they have been given blindly with no knowledge of amount needed or a plan of action.

Although I have respect for the trust I have always felt they have held their cards too close to their chest and that is particularily so here despite their earlier promise of transparency.

The director's bid was always a joke and I said it was a smokescreen to influence the SFA case against Rankine. This seems more of the same?

In fact the whole affair is beyond ajoke and is descending into farce with a constant battle between the directors and the trust when they should be working together. Unfortunately the directors have to toe Rankine's line but the trust does not so why do they expect us to blindly pledge?

Not for me even though I can withdraw later.


JJ - I imagine that any money raised would be for purchasing the shares, tackling the debt and giving the new board working capital to develop with . The share purchase is only a small component in this. The club as been valued at £0 so any purchase will likely be a nominal amount. The seller has no strength here. And no-one is going to pledge money just to line the seller's pockets. As Donald stated the details will need to be shared and questions answered but in principal, this is about all East Fife supporters coming together to save the club.

It may be that if enough is pledged the credit union funding won't be needed. No one in their right mind is going to borrow just to meet Rankine's asking price. Never going to happen.

Given that the directors rental bid is now dead, I hope they too get on board with the EFSS bid.

Re: Buy East Fife FC

So how much do you see the club being sold for G_Mal? Hard figure please?

Re: Buy East Fife FC

G_Mal
JJ
Am I the only one who feels uneasy about this. The trust is asking to pledge again for the purchase of shares. We have already done this. Is the new appeal in the hope it get a greater commitment with which to impress the lender? At least the directors gave the amount they needed. Withdrawable pledges are not going to have much impact on the lender's decision especially when they have been given blindly with no knowledge of amount needed or a plan of action.

Although I have respect for the trust I have always felt they have held their cards too close to their chest and that is particularily so here despite their earlier promise of transparency.

The director's bid was always a joke and I said it was a smokescreen to influence the SFA case against Rankine. This seems more of the same?

In fact the whole affair is beyond ajoke and is descending into farce with a constant battle between the directors and the trust when they should be working together. Unfortunately the directors have to toe Rankine's line but the trust does not so why do they expect us to blindly pledge?

Not for me even though I can withdraw later.


JJ - I imagine that any money raised would be for purchasing the shares, tackling the debt and giving the new board working capital to develop with . The share purchase is only a small component in this. The club as been valued at £0 so any purchase will likely be a nominal amount. The seller has no strength here. And no-one is going to pledge money just to line the seller's pockets. As Donald stated the details will need to be shared and questions answered but in principal, this is about all East Fife supporters coming together to save the club.

It may be that if enough is pledged the credit union funding won't be needed. No one in their right mind is going to borrow just to meet Rankine's asking price. Never going to happen.

Given that the directors rental bid is now dead, I hope they too get on board with the EFSS bid.
Grant, why are you peddling this horse shit? Tell me why the club is valued at 0. Twigg has 90 odd thousand shares and she will want her money back so the share price will be a large component of the amount. Who are you kidding that we may not need the Credit Union money. You are leading fans up a long and winding road (which reminds me of a season ago), fans won't get conned a second time. Why do you think we are going to get the club for nothing? We are up against a hard nosed business woman. Answer the question about how much money we need to borrow and what the interest rate will be and maybe you will get some interest until then sweet dreams.

Re: Buy East Fife FC

"Real, Realist" please keep the conversation civil. I appreciate that these are stressful times and emotions are high, but we're actually on the same side here - else why would we both be on AFTN in the first place!?!?

We have 2 professional valuations of the club. We have the club's own accounts showing the liabilities exceed assets to the tune of £90k. We also have the assessment conducted by the EFSS's advisers - again valuing the club at £0 for similar reasons (I believe).

Off course the seller wants more money back. But wanting and getting are 2 different things. Right now, with the business valued at £0, and with a forced sale, it is a take what you can get deal for them. Similar to the situation they acquired the shares under. Hard nosed or not, it's pretty clear that any offer from the EFSS is likely to be the best offer they'll ever get.

To my mind the offer should be a nominal amount - something in the range £1 to £30,000. What the EFSS bid is up to them. But the bid needs to also look at the debt and have a plan to run the club if the bid is accepted. This is why I hope the directors get onside with the EFSS but that's up to them.

If the seller decides to reject the offer, so be it. Better to have an offer rejected than pay over the odds and end up in a situation no better than we have today.

Re: Buy East Fife FC

Okay, I'll buy the club which will save the EFSS £30k. That will leave them to get on with running the club with no financial outlay for purchasing it. They obviously think they can run the club, so they are £30k better off, it's just that I will actually own the club. You can join the board as chairman if you like too!

How does that sound G_Mal? What could be easier?

Re: Buy East Fife FC

G_Mal
"Real, Realist" please keep the conversation civil. I appreciate that these are stressful times and emotions are high, but we're actually on the same side here - else why would we both be on AFTN in the first place!?!?

We have 2 professional valuations of the club. We have the club's own accounts showing the liabilities exceed assets to the tune of £90k. We also have the assessment conducted by the EFSS's advisers - again valuing the club at £0 for similar reasons (I believe).

Off course the seller wants more money back. But wanting and getting are 2 different things. Right now, with the business valued at £0, and with a forced sale, it is a take what you can get deal for them. Similar to the situation they acquired the shares under. Hard nosed or not, it's pretty clear that any offer from the EFSS is likely to be the best offer they'll ever get.

To my mind the offer should be a nominal amount - something in the range £1 to £30,000. What the EFSS bid is up to them. But the bid needs to also look at the debt and have a plan to run the club if the bid is accepted. This is why I hope the directors get onside with the EFSS but that's up to them.

If the seller decides to reject the offer, so be it. Better to have an offer rejected than pay over the odds and end up in a situation no better than we have today.


I totally agree with you that nothing more than 30k should be paid. If that was the case then the present Directors could go and pay this tomorrow because if you remember, they were willing to put up 25k each ! That money would then pay off a lot of the accrued debt the Club has.
However, Rankine whilst despised down Bayview way , he is not silly. He will want deeds to some of the surrounding land to get more of a return in the future for his investment. I reiterate my previous thoughts on the offer made by the Directors. £380k was offered. The 100k from the Rangers game was taken by the majority shareholder. Directors were told to say they were putting 25k up each to wipe 100k off the money offered but it was a paper transaction offset by the Rangers money. The takes figure down to £280k. Surrounding land to be sold to major shareholder for 80k taking money due to 200k which is the 40 blocks of 5k worth of shares the Board want fans, groups, EFSS to buy.
No danger will Rankine end up walking away with only 30k. Why would he accept that amount from EFSS when the Directors are dancing to his tune paying over the odds and land ownership part of the deal ?

Re: Buy East Fife FC

How much will it cost to run the club each month do you think Bayviewboy? I think that is an important figure and needs to be established before anybody puts any money into the bid.

Re: Buy East Fife FC

Just wondering.
How much will it cost to run the club each month do you think Bayviewboy? I think that is an important figure and needs to be established before anybody puts any money into the bid.


I'm sure EFSS said they've got a business plan which details what running costs would be. This can't be solid until they know what they will pay for the club and what debt they've got to deal with.

Re: Buy East Fife FC

I assume one can pledge now with payment subject to a viable business plan being made available for scrutiny and suggestion. Members input can be more than just financial!


Re: Buy East Fife FC

The present Directors are the only ones who can give an accurate answer to monthly costs. Much more information needs to be made available for fans to make an informed decision before signing up. Have the EFSS got an agreed figure with Rankine ? Are the Directors still pressing ahead with their bid ? What, if any part of the deal involves the land surrounding Bayview ? Etc.

Re: Buy East Fife FC

You are telling us what the club is worth, how much we should pay for it, but have no idea how much it costs to run each month? You seem to be full of knowledge on everything else, except how much it costs to keep the club going, by the sound of your reply? Probably the single most important issue the EFSS have to face. Bear in mind, no income so far from games in 2015.

Edit -

That was a reply to G_Mal actually, but applies equally to you to Bayviewboy.

Re: Buy East Fife FC

Nowhere have I said I am full of 'knowledge' but I have offered my thoughts and opinions. The monthly cost of running the club is something I've no doubt the EFSS have already worked out. They need to know what the monthly outgoings will be but it's irrelevant if they can't raise the money to buy out the majority shareholder. Fans need to know how much they are offering Rankine and how much is required each month to run the Club. Fans can then make a decision whether they wish to make a contribution or not.

Re: Buy East Fife FC

You have made a post saying what has happened to the Rangers money, what the directors bid is all about etc and that Rankine is pulling the strings, So are you saying now, that it is only your thoughts (conjecture) and you could be wildly wrong, Sir?

Re: Buy East Fife FC

Just wondering.
You are telling us what the club is worth, how much we should pay for it, but have no idea how much it costs to run each month? You seem to be full of knowledge on everything else, except how much it costs to keep the club going, by the sound of your reply? Probably the single most important issue the EFSS have to face. Bear in mind, no income so far from games in 2015.

Edit -

That was a reply to G_Mal actually, but applies equally to you to Bayviewboy.


Why do you say I have no idea what it costs to run a club? Accounts are accessible for all clubs in scotland. The big ones, the small ones and even the well run ones. All the data is accessible and comparable going back over many seasons. Sure the fine details like consultancy fees and bar bills might not be explicitly stated, but if it's just the monthly headline figures you are after you can easily find it out. If you like we can compare numbers.

What you'll find with East Fife though is that their income from sponsorship is on the low side compared to our peers. Sure there have been up ticks in the past - most notably during the wulllie gray era - but as a trend we've consistently had less revenue on the corporate side than the likes of Forfar, Brechin, Alloa, Arbroath. If the club can be relaunched then hopefully partnerships with the bussiness community can be built and we'll see the corportate revenue increase at least to the levels of our peers.

Understanding the costs is actually rather simple. Growing the revenue is the more challenging part. Any suggestions?

Re: Buy East Fife FC

Jocky, do us all a favour and keep to the one user name per thread please, at last count you have used three on this thread alone so far!
Your incessant trolling could threaten to derail this thread, as you have done successfully on so many others and honestly, I think this discussion is more important than your perennial, deviant antisocial behaviour!

Now please go away, the grown ups are talking!

Re: Buy East Fife FC

Real Realist / Investor with a big heart / Just wondering

I am just wondering why you have to use three different names in the space of four hours? It makes people think that anyone who expresses an opinion similar to you is just you, at it again. What is to be gained by doing this?
The people you are taking issue with are real people, whose identities are known. Where are the other people on your side of the debate? They all look like they are the same person.

Re: Buy East Fife FC

FFS

Your incessant trolling could threaten to derail this thread, as you have done successfully on so many others and honestly, I think this discussion is more important than your perennial, deviant antisocial behaviour!


Actually FFS, you are right. I'm just as guilty for playing with him when I should know better. As you say, the discussions are more important right now.

Sorry jockster -as much as I perversely enjoy watching you paint yourself into a corner I'm going to have to ignore you for a bit. Don't worry, I'll play with you next week.

Re: Buy East Fife FC

You are totally wrong, as the moderators can confirm. This seems to be the stock answer to questions that can't be answered with the same confidence as the posts that are telling us all that is bad about East Fife. Now we have G_Mal telling us he knows what Arbroath, Brechin, Forfar and Alloa's revenue is, by saying that it is higher than East Fife's. Where does this guy get all his information from. I would love him to actually put in black and white all these 'facts', as published by these clubs.

Re: Buy East Fife FC

G_Mal
FFS

Your incessant trolling could threaten to derail this thread, as you have done successfully on so many others and honestly, I think this discussion is more important than your perennial, deviant antisocial behaviour!


Actually FFS, you are right. I'm just as guilty for playing with him when I should know better. As you say, the discussions are more important right now.

Sorry jockster -as much as I perversely enjoy watching you paint yourself into a corner I'm going to have to ignore you for a bit. Don't worry, I'll play with you next week.


Is the discussion only valid if it is in line with your ideas G_Mal?

Re: Buy East Fife FC

Bayviewboy
The present Directors are the only ones who can give an accurate answer to monthly costs. Much more information needs to be made available for fans to make an informed decision before signing up. Have the EFSS got an agreed figure with Rankine ? Are the Directors still pressing ahead with their bid ? What, if any part of the deal involves the land surrounding Bayview ? Etc.


I'd assume the directors rental bid is now off since (frrm rankine's end at least) it did not have the desired effect - it neither convinced the SFA, got the EFSS on the leash or managed to secure the crowd funding cash.

The land sale is an interesting one. If the board are selling any of the club's assets on they are duty bound (and legally bound) to get the best return for all shareholders. They could not legally sell it to themselves or someone they represent for a knocked down price. This screwing over of the minority shareholders is simply not allowed and the authorities will not let it go unpunished.

I'm not saying that this is what is happening. I don't know the ins and outs of the proposed land deal but it will certainly be scruitanised by several parties.

I hope the directors seize the chance to get on board with the EFSS. If they go against the EFSS rather than with the EFSS then I really fear for the future. Neither side can afford a bidding war.

Re: Buy East Fife FC

Just wondering.
G_Mal
FFS

Your incessant trolling could threaten to derail this thread, as you have done successfully on so many others and honestly, I think this discussion is more important than your perennial, deviant antisocial behaviour!


Actually FFS, you are right. I'm just as guilty for playing with him when I should know better. As you say, the discussions are more important right now.

Sorry jockster -as much as I perversely enjoy watching you paint yourself into a corner I'm going to have to ignore you for a bit. Don't worry, I'll play with you next week.


Is the discussion only valid if it is in line with your ideas G_Mal?


Sorry, can't play with you just now. Important stuff going on. I'll lend you my pet hamster to keep you company in the meantime.



He likes to go round and round in circles all day. He doesn't have a name so call him what you want ....and feel free to change it whenever you like.

Re: Buy East Fife FC

Just wondering.
You are totally wrong, as the moderators can confirm. This seems to be the stock answer to questions that can't be answered with the same confidence as the posts that are telling us all that is bad about East Fife. Now we have G_Mal telling us he knows what Arbroath, Brechin, Forfar and Alloa's revenue is, by saying that it is higher than East Fife's. Where does this guy get all his information from. I would love him to actually put in black and white all these 'facts', as published by these clubs.


You see, what's happened is that we have got to know you. On this forum, people recognise your voice. They know the look of you. I am surprised you don't realise that.

Re: Buy East Fife FC

Brick wall from you lot when the heat is in your face and your argument is proven to hold no water. No reasonable counter comments to mine or the previous posters who are asking awkward questions, because you have no answer. The problem is, you weaken the trusts efforts by the constant criticisms and completely unproven comments you make on this site. It is the EFSS that you are harming more than anybody else.

Re: Buy East Fife FC

Just wondering.
Brick wall from you lot when the heat is in your face and your argument is proven to hold no water. No reasonable counter comments to mine or the previous posters who are asking awkward questions, because you have no answer. The problem is, you weaken the trusts efforts by the constant criticisms and completely unproven comments you make on this site. It is the EFSS that you are harming more than anybody else.


You have said all this before, again and again and again. Brick wall, hold no water, awkward questions, you have no answer, you are damaging the Trust. It's harder being someone else than you think. If I had no life I would find a previous example of each one under your various names and put them here.
See what I mean about we know when it is you? Night-night.

Re: Buy East Fife FC

fifer
Just wondering.
Brick wall from you lot when the heat is in your face and your argument is proven to hold no water. No reasonable counter comments to mine or the previous posters who are asking awkward questions, because you have no answer. The problem is, you weaken the trusts efforts by the constant criticisms and completely unproven comments you make on this site. It is the EFSS that you are harming more than anybody else.


You have said all this before, again and again and again. Brick wall, hold no water, awkward questions, you have no answer, you are damaging the Trust. It's harder being someone else than you think. If I had no life I would find a previous example of each one under your various names and put them here.
See what I mean about we know when it is you? Night-night.


Still no answer! Why am I not surprised? You need to learn how to debate, you can only seem to agree with those on your side of a discussion and when you get asked questions you can't answer, you revert to accusations of who is who. Try and come up with an argument to what is being put to you. You want an anonymous forum, well you have to live with that I'm afraid.

Re: Buy East Fife FC

Silence is golden .... but my eyes still see !




(Okay, I admit it, I am also Just wondering).

Re: Buy East Fife FC

Anyone else chuckle at the irony in the "learn how to debate" comment?

My mate Dave said I don't understand irony - which was ironic because we were at the bus stop at the time.

But, while we're on the subject of the debating, does anyone wish to make the point that we're best off with the present owner? If not then can we all agree ownership change is a necessity ?

Re: Buy East Fife FC

Hear hear!

I'm in.

And I don't really need to know much about the finer details. I can see very well that the last 20 years of majority shareholder ownership haven't been kind to us, and I think it's time to try something else.

I think fan ownership can be the catalyst for turning things around.

Re: Buy East Fife FC

It’s really encouraging to see that this thread has been viewed over 1000 times in less than a couple of days. There is strong interest in this subject, and so there should be.
I tried to say from the outset that not everyone’s questions could be answered at this stage. A successful bid for the club is going to take negotiation. I would say it is virtually impossible for EFSS to say how much money is needed at this stage, especially when last year’s asking price was so high. What this part of the process is about is fans giving their backing to a collective buy-out. Whoever conducts the negotiations can’t get to the table without some sort of backing from East Fife supporters (and again, I mean all kinds of East Fife supporters).
It’s also unlikely that even in the best case scenario of a successful offer, every fan who backed the bid will be happy. It can’t be tailored to meet with everyone’s individual demands. The only way a collective effort can work is if people rally round the principle, and accept that the greater goal is the priority.
Someone made an interesting point in this thread about how the majority shareholders got their stake in East Fife in the first place. The previous major shareholder was in a spot of bother, and had to sell, fast. He was given a take it or leave it deal, and had no option but to take it. His shares were sold at a 50% discount. That’s business.
For those who have said that this isn’t for them, I have to ask - when will an attempt to buy the club be for them? Ever? Who else are you waiting for to come forward? This is the chance for you to make a bid happen. If you think the existing bid is over the odds at £380,000, this is the chance to offer an alternative, and one which everyone can get involved in. The chance will pass if supporters don’t have the will to back it.
Do we want a better East Fife that we can all pool together to achieve, or will we sit tight and “see what happens”? Good luck!

Re: Buy East Fife FC

Donald Walker
It’s really encouraging to see that this thread has been viewed over 1000 times in less than a couple of days. There is strong interest in this subject, and so there should be.
I tried to say from the outset that not everyone’s questions could be answered at this stage. A successful bid for the club is going to take negotiation. I would say it is virtually impossible for EFSS to say how much money is needed at this stage, especially when last year’s asking price was so high. What this part of the process is about is fans giving their backing to a collective buy-out. Whoever conducts the negotiations can’t get to the table without some sort of backing from East Fife supporters (and again, I mean all kinds of East Fife supporters).
It’s also unlikely that even in the best case scenario of a successful offer, every fan who backed the bid will be happy. It can’t be tailored to meet with everyone’s individual demands. The only way a collective effort can work is if people rally round the principle, and accept that the greater goal is the priority.
Someone made an interesting point in this thread about how the majority shareholders got their stake in East Fife in the first place. The previous major shareholder was in a spot of bother, and had to sell, fast. He was given a take it or leave it deal, and had no option but to take it. His shares were sold at a 50% discount. That’s business.
For those who have said that this isn’t for them, I have to ask - when will an attempt to buy the club be for them? Ever? Who else are you waiting for to come forward? This is the chance for you to make a bid happen. If you think the existing bid is over the odds at £380,000, this is the chance to offer an alternative, and one which everyone can get involved in. The chance will pass if supporters don’t have the will to back it.
Do we want a better East Fife that we can all pool together to achieve, or will we sit tight and “see what happens”? Good luck!


Great post.

Re: Buy East Fife FC

G_Mal
Anyone else chuckle at the irony in the "learn how to debate" comment?

My mate Dave said I don't understand irony - which was ironic because we were at the bus stop at the time.

But, while we're on the subject of the debating, does anyone wish to make the point that we're best off with the present owner? If not then can we all agree ownership change is a necessity ?


Nobody is saying that we want the status quo. The queries I am making are to highlight that the major shareholders will most likely not accept a lowly offer in the region you are suggesting. The directors would have to withdraw their bid to combine with a new EFSS/Directors bid and if that bid is ridiculously low, where does that leave everybody if the MS don't accept it and take the club off the market? As it happens, I think that the EFSS are not planning to follow your valuation of the club, as they know full well that it would definitely be rejected, hence going to a loan company for funds to finance a more realistic bid. It is really laughable that you think the club will be sold for a figure as low as £30000. You are suggesting you will withdraw your pledge if the price is not right, so what price are you willing to go up to G_Mal?
Donald Walker is correct in saying that there is an opportunity for everyone that cares about the club to get involved, so please be realistic G_Mal and stop posting ridiculous valuations that may encourage some people to pledge money, only to withdraw (like you) later, when the almost certain much higher price is announced. The eventual bid if it happens, is going to have to involve everybody, including the current directors and if it doesn't include them, then I fear any EFSS bid will fail unfortunately, due to lack of guaranteed funds. If a combined bid can be agreed and the money is there and guaranteed by those donating, only then can there be a bid involving the EFSS. If pledged donations can be withdrawn, then what happens next if they are - square 1?

Just so you know, there will probably be much, much, much more chance of me donating to the EFSS bid than you G_Mal, so please don't think you have the moral high ground in this 'debate'. I am simply being more realistic than you about it.

Re: Buy East Fife FC

Sounds like we are in agreement that a change of owner is required.

And we are in agreement that a combined bid is best.

While I agree the seller will obviously look to maximize their sale price, the conditions of this limited, time bound, financially restricted market do not lend themselves to anything other than a substantial markdown.

You and I can chew the fat on what that mark down is going to be ....... but since neither you are I are the seller, it would be a pretty meaningless discussion.

If the absolute maximum markdown the seller is willing to accept is still higher that the absolute markup (from the £0 valuation) the buyer is willing to offer - then there will be no deal.

The process is not about meeting the sellers asking price. It is about meeting a mutually acceptable price that both parties are happy with.

Re: Buy East Fife FC

G_Mal
Sounds like we are in agreement that a change of owner is required.

And we are in agreement that a combined bid is best.

While I agree the seller will obviously look to maximize their sale price, the conditions of this limited, time bound, financially restricted market do not lend themselves to anything other than a substantial markdown.

You and I can chew the fat on what that mark down is going to be ....... but since neither you are I are the seller, it would be a pretty meaningless discussion.

If the absolute maximum markdown the seller is willing to accept is still higher that the absolute markup (from the £0 valuation) the buyer is willing to offer - then there will be no deal.

The process is not about meeting the sellers asking price. It is about meeting a mutually acceptable price that both parties are happy with.


I concur.

Re: Buy East Fife FC

Just wondering.
You are telling US what the club is worth .....

Yet another attempt to make yourself appear plural. You'll be talking to yourself soon.

Re: Buy East Fife FC

I'm not in a position to offer huge amounts of cash towards this venture (unfortunately)However I am willing to pledge what I can on an ongoing basis in order to see the club owned by people who genuinely care about it. I know a few active members of the EFSS and am absolutely confident that they fall into this category, I don't really know any of the directors but have met Dave Marshall a few times and am equally confident of his commitment to the club.
I very much hope a way forward can be found, good luck everyone!

Re: Buy East Fife FC

Who is running this is it David Walker. I though it was Eugene and Alan Duthie. What has happened to them does anyone know they are saying nothing about all this

Re: Buy East Fife FC

methilman
Who is running this is it David Walker. I though it was Eugene and Alan Duthie. What has happened to them does anyone know they are saying nothing about all this


EFSS sent an email to all who registered. The email is just under Donald Walkers's first post.

Re: Buy East Fife FC

methilman
Who is running this is it David Walker. I though it was Eugene and Alan Duthie. What has happened to them does anyone know they are saying nothing about all this


The EFSS Working Group are pushing this initiative. Allan, Eugene, Liam, Kerriann, Paul, Laura, Colin and Stephen.