Unless I'm mistaken there have been dozens of posts in the last day or so about who owns what, who has spent what, how much A, B, and C have invested etc etc, and four actually about the team and last night's game.

Frankly, Willie and Sid must wonder why on earth they are spending tens of thousands of pounds each on a club whose supporters spend all their time speculating about what, to be frank, has nothing to do with them and seem to be less interested in what happens on the field.

It's all got out of hand, guys. Too much analysing, speculating and whistling in the wind. Unless you get back to being straightforward supporters you'll just lose interest in the whole thing because you have damn all chance of influencing what happens in the corridor of power.

Absolutely right. Attendance last night - 304. The pits. Serious professional football I don't think. Frankly we're lucky, very lucky that Willie and Sid (who seems to have Twigg backing) have come on the scene. Suggest we get off their backs.

Frankly, people can talk about what the hell they want.
Who are you to say otherwise?

Observer

Please describe your vision of a "straightforward supporter" to me .I see myself as one you see and I just wonder how I differ from you,if at all.

Someone who keeps his gub shut and pays his money.

I was so pleased to see that the protest had ended and looked forward to a return to normal service, fans getting behind the team and all that. Alas the promises that were made by the protesters fell at the first hurdle, 304 in the ground. What was all the talk about fans returning on mass once the protests finished. I said months ago that fans would not return just as happened at Starks park during their period of protest. Fans wont return because of a protest ending but they will come back if we climb the league and make a serious challenge. The folk who led the protest got a wee bit ahead of themselves when they thought they could get fans back into the ground on their say so.

I don't think they said that

I thought they just said the protests were to be halted

Were you really expecting a huge attendance increase for a midweek cup game that we were expecting to lose?

There were at least 25-30 people there who wouldn't have been there a couple of weeks ago.

Also, the club won't be able to bulk up the attendance with the season ticket numbers (like they normally do) as (a) they won't have sold many and (b) they weren't valid anyway.

"The folk who led the protest got a wee bit ahead of themselves when they thought they could get fans back into the ground on their say so."

The only people who can get people back in the ground are Willie & Sid. Protests are a reaction to a problem - Willie & sid are in the position to solve the problem. They have started by getting a winning team on the park, and getting rid of brown. Noises have been made about getting the Trust on board. Once these 3 things have been done, then see waht the crowd is - until then, it is work-in-progress.

To Dave Marshall - Dave, must of us, you included, spent years watching, following, supporting, laughing, cheering, crying with our team without knowing or caring a tuppenny damn about who was on the Board or what was going on behind the scenes. That's what I mean by a "straightforward supporter" .

And before the usual abuse is heaped on me, let's just ask ourselves whether that wasn't more enjoyable and isn't what supporters worldwide do. AT EF we have got hooked on the drug of low-level football politics that we don't understand and can't influence, and I just think it is on the point of ruining the whole thing for most of us. Well, it certainly has for me anyway.

Some good points but we've had an extraordinary situation where a penniless chairman (who sits in the middle of the team photo - alienates fans with grammatically shit press releases on the official site etc)

Once he's gone it'll be normal service as fans.

When Brown took over we had just achieved promotion.

1.A year later we had been relegated.

2.A year after that we struggled in the bottom half of Division 3.

3.We are struggling in the same position this season.

4.Season tickets sales have fallen.

5.Player sponsorships have fallen.

6.Advertising boards are less than last year.

7.The Young Fifers have been criticised. Derrick attacked the Young Fifers for running busses to away games because it was “giving money to other clubs”.

8.The Trust have been savaged. Derrick described the Trust as “the biggest off field challenge the club faces”.

9.The respected broadsheet The Scotsman has run a full page article questioning his ability to run a club.

10.He has been described as universally loathed in The Sunday Mail.

11.He has made racist remarks at a supporters club meeting. On a separate occasion he said that he “wouldn’t tell that joke to a darkie” - Meanwhile East Fife supporters team the Bayview Allstars proudly represented the club at a “Show Racism The Red Card” five aside tournament in Kirkcaldy. A campaign that Derrick has avoided pledging support to.

12.He lied to shareholders and directed them to vote against allowing The Trust more shares at The AGM of EFFC.

13.He claimed supporters who enjoyed a pint or two at local hostelries before games were not true supporters.

14.He claimed to be more of a supporter than everyone else.

15.He operates under long term proxy from buddy Neil Rankines girlfriends daughters large shareholding whilst dismissing supporters money for shares.

16.Derrick raised the issue of Hearts manager Graham Rix “not being a fit and proper person” to manage a football club. Derrick Brown is a former close friend and colleague of Julian Danskin. He claimed that “one hundred women” had phoned him to congratulate him on his stance.

17.Derrick thought it was acceptable to tell the players they would need to bring a packed lunch for an away trip to Elgin.

18.He also claimed that players should provide their own towels after matches to cut the risk of spreading HIV (because there have been a lot of cases of stuff like this happening, obviously…).

19.When ex-director Davie Marshall was volunteering as kit man he commented to Derrick that the bags were a bit heavy for a man of his age, instead of getting some help for Davie, Derrick Brown told the manager to take less kit!

20.Derrick Brown argued against the sell of shares to the supporters trust by saying if “they get in we could all lose our places on the board”.

21.Derrick then welcomed an ex-Raith Rovers chairman onto the board without any concern whatsoever.

22.Upon sacking manager Jim Moffat, Derrick stated that the “board has a responsibility to its shareholders” – no mention of supporters, the community or local businesses. Derrick states that he has a duty to look after the investments of his backers, yet he is the sole reason that an average of fifty supporters stand on the mound at home games, whilst hundreds of others stay away altogether.

23.Despite being listed as East Fife FC’s “PR Officer” Derrick refused to comment when 150 supporters and a pipe band marched to Bayview to demand his resignation.

24.The organised supporters protest march against Brown was originally due to pass past the front entrance to the ground. Derrick contacted the police to say this “wouldn’t be safe” because of the roadworks in front of the stadium. In other words it wouldn’t be safe for 150 people to walk past the ground, yet their was a football match on that day and allegedly 375 people were in attendance, it was not “unsafe” for these people to walk past the front of the stadium apparently.

25.Derrick had previously claimed that the protesters, or “those people” as he called them, were not harming him but we were harming East Fife FC. At that point the money the protests had cost the club was only 10% of the money the Trust offered the club to buy shares with no strings attached – an offer that Derrick rejected!

26.Despite stating that the protests were harming the club, Derrick was told that the minute he steps down they will cease. If he really “supports East Fife more than we do” then he might consider putting the club first, he has since point blank refused to step down on a number of occasions.

27.Derrick refused the press entry to a public meeting with supporters on the grounds that it “would not be fair to supporters”, no supporters were asked for their opinions on this at the time however but it was nice of him to speak on our behalf.

28.Being Trust members the Board received their allotted two books of raffle tickets last year. Derrick refused to sell his as half of the proceeds were going to charity (Rachel House, a charity for the care of terminally ill children). Apparently it is the duty of supporter groups to fund raise for the Club only. Derrick had made similar comments when the Supporters Club held two charity "Stars in their Eyes" shows (Maggie Centre and Young Fifers). He said he would return his books unsold and recommended that all Board members do the same.

29. Shortly after protests had began against Derrick on the mound overlooking the pitch he was under the impression that to halt a peaceful protest or demonstration you don’t need to deal with the causes of the dispute, you just need to prevent action from being taken. In which case he tried to have the mound demolished to prevent us from assembling there. Needless to say he had bitten off more than he could chew and was unable to move the mound, he just made an even bigger mess of the place than was already there.

30.In the past Derrick Brown had accused the Trust of “going through the media” to conduct its business with the club. He claimed that East Fife did not operate in this way. In early April of this year he released a statement on the clubs website in which he started by welcoming new boss David Baikie, moved swiftly onto a scathing attack on the protesting fans and finished by stating that the club had received an application from the Trust to buy shares. So much for not “going through the media”!

31.He claimed that “The Board of Directors would be happy to meet with a representative of the protestors to explore the way forward.” four weeks after the supporters had made two requests for such a meeting to take place, both requests had been ignored.

32.After several weeks of East Fife’s home attendances struggling to reach the 300 mark, Derrick claimed that his statement attacking the fans had attracted some hostility from a minority – but this would be condemned “by the wider Levenmouth community” and by “right-thinking people”, one can only speculate as to what drugs he was on when this was written.

33.Derrick makes no secret of the fact that our club does not belong to the supporters, but the major shareholders who invested in the club. Yet he desires to see public monies being invested in East Fife FC to fund a plastic pitch and changing facilities, which is rumoured to be part of his plan to create full time jobs at Bayview for him and his family.

34.Derrick boasted that “East Fife is my pension”.

35.In raising the “fit and proper person” question over Graham Rix at Hearts, the same question has inevitably come back to haunt Derrick after the appointment of David Baikie who has a criminal record for serious assault.

36.When tabloid newspaper The Sun were offering money off vouchers for Scottish Cup matches, Derrick asked club volunteers to go out and buy all copies of The Sun from local newsagents, then fill out all the coupons to claim back money, I am no expert on the law but is this not known as fraud?

37.Derrick doesn’t like women in the boardroom at football matches, except of course his wife and daughter because “he is the Chairman”.

38.When Derrick arrived back at Bayview following his adventures at Cowdenbeath FC (where he remained a bigger East Fife supporter than all of you) a centenary committee was in place (put together by ex-Chairman Bruce Black) made up of lifelong fans and local historians who’s aim was to plan the events for the clubs 100th birthday. Before they knew it however, they were told they were no longer required. Derrick had taken over and decided to do everything himself - like organise the invitations to former players to attend the Centenary match versus Hearts - and invite entirely the wrong people after Jim Beavers had made up a list which was ignored. Then he introduced John McGarrity as one half of Scotland's oldest married couple, thinking he was introducing 1930's 'keeper John Bernard!

39.Derrick refused to attend an away game at East Stirlingshire because they refused to put extra security on to protect him from the evil protesters, he had also requested that anyone with “those t-shirts” on should be banned from the ground. We are always glad to see a representative of our club set such a good example at other grounds around Scotland, as will the wider Levenmouth community and right-thinking people.

40.At a recent home game, former director and season ticket holder Dave Marshall left his seat at half time to collect ticket money on the mound for the Supporters Club POTY dance that evening. He was then refused re-entry to the ground by the stewards through the direct instruction of Derrick Brown.

41.Derrick recently hired a “bodyguard” to watch him at matches, presumably the bill is being footed by East Fife FC.

42.Despite all of the above, our vocal protest against Derrick Brown at an away match at Cowdenbeath was described as “nothing short of disgraceful” and “a stain on the clubs name”. As you can see, irony is not lost on this man.

A strong case for him to be hung, drawn and quartered, I agree. In fact probably the best I've read and one that should be forwarded to the press and to SFA and the League.

But you will probably agree too that the fun has gone out of the whole thing. And I just wish I could believe that once DB's gone we'll all just return to being fans. I doubt that this is possible now and although I know that something had to be done about Derrick I am just very sad that a lifetime's interest just as a supporter has more or less gone out of the window in favour of plotting and planning.

Frankly football life was better, more interesting and more enjoyable just standing at the Bayview end. And I suspect most people feel that. How can I/we get back to that level of "straightforward" supporter enjoyment?

This is a very interesting exchange. Absolutely brilliant analysis by St Pauli Fifer which I agree should be circulated more widely.

Comments from Observer are sad, but all too true, though. Just a few years ago I wouldn't have thought it possible, but what has been a life's interest is just not that any more. Maybe I should get out more and stop posting on websites!

But seriously how do we recover from all this and get our level of interest back as individual lifelong supporters? Can we, or has it all become more than just supporting our team?

All the points are from the Down with Brown blog and are in the Crimes of Brown section.

It would be alot easier if all we could do is go and watch the fitba then go home, I agree with that. However, the times they are a changin.

So it seems, but in truth only at EF.

"AT EF we have got hooked on the drug of low-level football politics that we don't understand and can't influence"

I don't agree. There's nothing complex about running a football club. And those that want to can influence things.

If you want to be a "straight forward" supporter, fine - what's stopping you? If I want to get involved in improving EF, how does this impinge on your "straight forward" supporting? To me, these methods of suppport ARE mutually exclusive.

Observer
I remember the days you describe very well and,like you, cannot wait to get back to them.

I totally agree that the last year has been an unhappy one,as will everyone involved in the search for change.The cure for any unpleasant malady is always going to be traumatic but,happily in this case,the patient is showing signs of perking up.

I have the benefit,if you can call it that, of having worked for Derrick and you can take my word for it that he had to be removed.St Pauli Fifer lists his catalogue of crimes so there is no need for me to recite them.

Like all my ex-collegues I paid for the privilege of serving Derricks' desire to run the club by himself,for himself.The approach demanded by him resulted in the board I served on being the most incompetent in East Fife's history.It could not be allowed to continue.Fortunately enough supporters felt likewise and the demand for change began.History will go on to show that the club will be indebted to Matthew and Steve and their fellow protesters for the actions they took and the changes for good they have brought about to which I add my personal thanks.If the well organised protests had not taken place then Derrick would still be chairman and in all probability Jim Moffat would still be manager.Willie Gray would have still have funded the signing of a couple of our current squad but the bulk of our players would have been of similar ability to the last two seasons.Does not bear thinking about.

On a personal note, I am a proud, passionate East Fife supporter and could no longer allow Derrick to undermine me and the club I love.I can assure you that even if the protests had not taken place I would have resigned from the board.To this day I find it impossible to understand why my ex-collegues were prepared to let Derrick carry on using them like he did.I resigned in order to see his removal from the board and I will continue to work away at achieving that.I will have to do in a calmer manner,however.The ravages of time,bad living,ill-nature and passion for all things East Fife have combined to issue me a health warning in the form on a mini stroke(sounds worse than it is) and I would be silly to ignore it.However,I promised Derrick that I would be supporting East Fife well after he was long gone and that will happen.

When the protests were taking place people joined in to achieve different things.As their aims were met they left and this will happen until everyone is satisfied.What we should not be doing is being critical of one anothers' actions.The protest was always an individual choice matter and should remain so without ridicule both from those who have left and those choosing to carry on.

Thanks for listening ,Observer,I know it is difficult for some supporters to accept everything that has gone on in their name but I am certain that history will show that the medicine did its' job.

I think it's important to remember the wider context of what's happening in Scottish (and UK) football in terms of supporters involvment.

The Supporters Direct movement has changed the politics of sport and it is now accepted by many including the football authorities (albeit reluctantly) and the UK and Scottish governments that supporters should be much more involved in their clubs than in the past.

With us at East Fife the Brown nonsense has maybe obscured what would have been happening anyway in terms of the fans wanting to contribute more to the club than simply paying their gate money.

When a few people got together to set up the Trust itwasn't to get rid of Brown. We naively believed that even he would welcome another way of getting financial and other support from fans. We were wrong and his stupid pigheaded reaction to our wishes to help is what has led to all the protest.

Clubs with Trust involvement are now a fact of life in the majority of senior clubs in Britain - not all with board representation.

This is the future of football and the future of community involvment in clubs. Here at Bayview we can in five years time have indoor and outdoor sports facilities for the entire local community but only if the club works with all the other partners including the Trust.

The politics of sport have changed. I believe for the better.

First time reply on the forum, it's late but good to read both David Marshalls and Eugines comments.Will it be possible for East Fife to be united again? I watched East Fife all Last season from inside the ground and even went for a bevvy in the bar, maybay i was ignorant of what was going on, all i knew was the team were underperforming (shite), but i still paid my money to come and see them. In my ignorance i watched the mound and wondered what the hell was going on, and what the fuss was all about.
By writing this message i have now become involved in however minor a capacity, my fear is for a split in the support, some messages have already reffered to twenty years ago and we remember who the scabs are.
I salute the protesters, what they have acheived and what hopefully will be acheived in the near future. I hope the way forward though is as a united support and club without the nessescity for us to be debating who is for and who is against this or that, or the politics involved, rather than who we should be signing to return to the higher echelons of Scottish Football.
Did i just slaver pish ?

"Did i just slaver pish ?"

Er...the truthfulness of my answer depends on whether you'll be a passenger again - I could be a bit vulnerable!

Bigfifer you make perfect sense to me. I wish for the same thing but this will not be possible until Brown is removed. If he was removed from Bayview today we would all be delighted and at last the focus would return to stuff we used to talk about like "why is the Bairn not getting a start" and "Moffat is a muppet"

Excellent posts which sums up all true supporters feelings. I am a lifelong fan who justs wants to work hard for a living and look after my family and watch the Fife. As we all know, raising a family and working full time, never mind trying to be succesful in business is more than a wee bit stressful. All these frustrations used to be forgotten come a Saturday afternoon. Home games:
Fife strip washed and ironed by Maggie.
Scarf and tammie at the ready.
Into The Grosvener for a few pints and a wee nip.
Onto the Social club [old ground]
Margaret ran that place well and always a laugh and knew our names.
Fife supporters turning up, club starting to buzz.
Away supportesr turning up, singing starts [from both sides]
Discussions about MacCafferty [great wee player]
Kirkwood, Durie, etc.
Into the ground and you didn't have to roar "C'mon Fife, gie us something to shout about" Because the Fife were up for it with a good side then. Entertaining and capable of scoring in any ground they went to.
We were able to put the working week at the back of our minds and support the team. The ground was getting old but it had something about it. When you have been going there since pre-school and still going, taking your own children, there's a bond built that sadly was broken by moving to New Bayview.
Ofcourse, the blow could have been softened by having a successful team on the park, which we did have for one season, but instead of building on that, well, i don't need to tell you more.

I want a ground that's complete all the way around.
I want to stand/sit behind the goal if i choose.
I want a social club that's big enough for the supporters without having to stand with a pint in one hand and a whisky in the other and no place to lay them.
I want a social club that does what the name stands for, with a seperate lounge with more Tv's and a pool table [we are not all corporate you know]
Get rid of the restuarant to give us more room, bloody nightmare when a decent travelling support comes.
I want better scarfs instead of the dull design we have, scottish cups and league cups printed on them or do i have to have them made myself and sell them in the pub?
Sell the Fife stuff outside the ground instead of the comfortable wee shop at the top of the stairs.
Sorry for ranting on, buti am on week number 3 offshore and the frustration is creeping in.
See you all for the Friday E.Stirling game. That's the day i get home and i will be on a blevvy.

C'MON FIFE, GIE US SOMTHIN' TAE SHOUT ABOOT!!!!

Be as truthfull as you like Eugine, but if we ever get lost in a forest of cones you get eaten first

Fifeyboab

You are singing from the same hymn sheet as me, You would have glowed with pride at the sight of your pub today, one half East Fife players, the other half diehard fans reminiscing about Rangers and Dunfermline games 1986-87, Dundee United 90-1.
We are getting back to the normality that we all yearn for, it's been hard work but it is going to be worth it.
Do you want a laugh? This evening I've been enjoying the Arbroath Blues Festival wearing my East Fife top...

Brilliant A.F I haven't called home yet, so i didn't know how the weekend went. That's why i am looking for any film footage or radio commentary to play during match days. I was in a pub in amsterdam around 4 years ago [heading home, ahem] The customers all had ajax colours on. The barmaid had radio commentary on of one of ajax games and it was edited to play the most atmospheric parts of the game. What an atmosphere in the pub. The fans were singing and she was turning up the volume until it was like being at the game. They were playing in a european tie that night against a spanish team. I was so caught up that if i had another couple of amstels i would have gone to the game.